Polar Storms

Wow! Those images can make a cloud guy cry. I guess we can only dream what it would look like. I knew when I saw that storm dropping snow up north that we could see some old fashion low clouds. What we need is an automatic weather balloon and send her up.

That image would be proof of a deep moisture layer by Mars standards in the afternoon. Can’t wait to see the first snow. Great image Hort.

Fred

Hort

Hold the presses. I see a lot of white in this image spotty on the ground more noticeable around the rocks and on top of the rocks. Could be we had a snow shower come by. If you can tell me if what is white is white I would thank you a lot.

Ill be in the waiting room, pacing.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3155/2815719237_f1b4a32ab8_o.jpg

Fred

Er, no snow yet. See this version of reply 41.

I will work on some of the other cloud pictures. The colorized version of the animation looks very wrong! Lots of reds. Maybe a dust storm?

Hort,

We can rule out dust clouds because of the will defined edges. Dust would be more diffuse except on the leading edge and we would have a rapid reduction in visibility.

Thanks for the image.

Fred

The weather reports are here:
http://www.space.gc.ca/asc/eng/exploration/phoenix_weather1.asp

The pressure has dropped as the atmospheric CO2 has deposited on the southern cap, but as the season changes the insolation of the southern cap will start to increase and the CO2 will sublimate in the South and will start to deposit in the north. But at the moment it is still a toasty -30 max to a brisk -84 minimum. Not much H20 carrying capacity at that temp.

Brian,

Cold for sure. Saturation at -30 contains less water than saturation at +30. That’s why they call it, “relative humidity.”

Fred

Brian,

Found an Earth comparison for the Mars clouds. This was taken from the south pole on Earth. It gets a little chilly. The 2001 weather data showed a max for the year of -22C and a min of -77C.

Look at those clouds, aint they Purdy. Oh If we could muster a few more k, say 100 K vs. 5K. I guess the squeaky wheel gets the grease and the weather types at NASA are not squeaking.

Just for you Strato-fractus at the south pole of Earth, the worlds greatest desert.

Fred

http://www.coolantarctica.com/Bases/South_Pole/south_pole0050.html

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3078/2817687220_fa465d1ceb_o.jpg

Here is a vertical montage of the sol 95 clouds.

Making this a "nice" picture would require more patience than I have today.

Outstanding !
Color is just a dream, just a dream, dream.

Now lets review:

We have a visible accumulation of water vapor at about three hundred feet (Clouds). Check

We have water ice frost formation on instrumentation in the wind. Check

We have persistence water ice frost formation on Lander leg. Check

We have water ice on the surface from landing rockets. Check

We have seen water frost formation on the surface. Check

We have exposed water ice from under the surface. Check


Looks to me like we have landed in a desert. Dry as dust. Humidity .0000003%, No water for two bazillion years. Now all we need is some flat dust. I’ll keep my eyes open.

Fred


We have verification on the clouds. Water ice clouds they say and even made a movie from images we did not get. I wonder what else we did not get.

“The science team has been studying a movie created from still pictures of the nearby Martian sky showing dramatic water ice clouds moving over the landing site during a 10-minute period on Sol 94 (Aug. 29).

"The images were taken as part of a campaign to see clouds and track wind. These are clearly ice clouds," said Mark Lemmon, the lead scientist for the lander's surface stereo imager, from Texas A&M University.”

Now I would call this a, “Good,” movie. Not a, “Nice,” movie.

Fred

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3118/2821211668_f563c395e7_o.gif

After looking at the sol 94 data a little closer this is the high tech anemometer. Looks like peak winds for the mission. Looks like we had a frontal passage complete with clouds

Expect More frequent events as fall approaches in the North. Should have issued a High Wind Warning.

Could start a first snowfall pool. Good times for the weather types.

Fred
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3060/2821481274_e77d208b72_o.jpg


My quote from reply 34 of this thread.

“Hort we could get rapid sublimation or even melting as the storm track sags south post max heating. This may give us a rare glimpse of cumulo fractus Mars style. If you get a chance to monitor cloud movements off the ice pack that would be a treasure.”

That was August 30th. I may be mistaken but I think that was the first sky condition forecast ever issued from Earth for a Mars mission site that verified. Yea, baby. It happened here on the Mars Rover Blogg.

Now in my mind that is a big deal. Rock guys can say what they want and we can not say for sure until we get there. Weather is different. Maybe you guys did not even read it or care about it, but it was a great moment in weather history that few will ever know.

We will always be grateful for Hort and his images. That is what separates this place from the rest. Brian, Ben you contributions are great. Winston you have always been able to see the water and John you are still a prick. :-)

Fred

Er, a more complete record of the SSI images is here. I personally don't believe the cloud movie was made with the JPG versions. It is a good example of what we are not seeing.

Here is the UA version of the vertical panorama cloud mosaic:

Ain't no way in hell anyone is gonn'a get this from the JPGs.

Now it would appears NASA has been caught with their pants down.

First they present a great quality image from sol 94 with images we did not see. The movie shows low clouds. I will contrast this with a Winston image that he produced because I ask him to. Good going old chap. Good to have a reference point other than an old drunk.

We can see the height difference. We can also see what they are feeding Hort.

All I got to say is if you want to cut off the weatherman then you will need to alter all data. I been around the block with satellite imagery.

Fred

NASA image

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3118/2821211668_f563c395e7_o.gif

Winston Image

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3075/2821130463_6753060e49_o.gif

It's the first time I have seen the clouds so low and dramatically change shape as they roll by there is one in the middle of the frame in your link 1 Fred that looks like it hits a thermal on the way through the "jet stream" is moving fast also.

http://www.jpl.nasa.gov/news/phoenix/

This Link

http://www.jpl.nasa.gov/images/phoenix/collection_16/15777.gif

KPM

Glad you came by before the afternoon relegates me to music and booze.

We did get a glimpse of the Martian atmospheric structure. I will present the image. On Earth we have a three belt Jet stream. Artic, Sub-tropical and tropical.

On Mars looks like a two belt system. Looks like an active jet for sure I tried for an illustration. The truth is in the pudding. More to come.

Fred

The yellow circle is the jet. The step down of atmospheric structure is classic.

This is a Rosetta image

Fred

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3246/2821315765_6b8700c2c7_o.jpg

Do not go to sleep on me boys.

Fred

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HMSWAUAKJn0

Lets go country. Willie is a youngen.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FC5MHtQWeYU&feature=related

Fred

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kORuZVZGavI&feature=relatedA better version

Fred